External limiting an GTIL2 SUN-1000G2 with raspberry

I have two GTILs that i want to monitor locally and control some things based on the power in and out.

I have wired an XBee S1 set to transparent mode directly to the pcb pins that are labelled RS232.

Conveniently, there is a 3.4V power supply on one of the pins and can power the XBee directly. Its on the upper end of the XBee 3.4V max input power spec . Ive had it running with no issues for the past two weeks. The rx/tx lines are 3.3V/3.4V so they can also connect to the tx/rx of the XBee directly.

The diagonal pads next to the rs232 text is a jumper to 12V presumably to power line drivers

If we call pin 1 the one closest to the corner ofnthe board next to the cable going to the lcd display
1= Gnd
2=3.4VDC
4=txen for rs485 line driver
5= tx output
6=rx input
7 = 12VDC when the diagonal pads are jumpered

I dont know what the other lines do but these suffice for serial data. They are set to 9600-8-N1 and running modbus protocol

From what i see, It seems what is sent out of the wifi module is Just a couple of the registers.

Watts out appears to be a running average, not what is displayed on the lcd

Im trying to decipher the LCD cable frames next as that must have all of the data displayed on the lcd...which is what i need . Those also appear to be a modbus variation and 9600-8N1
 
Thanks for the info i will get anXBee S1 and start to play with thatfirst.
I will look forward to see what you gleen from the display interface.

Wolf
 
Quick update...
I'm sniffing the LCD wires now with my XBee tied to the Tx going into the LCD. I mounted a standard 2dBi 2.4Ghz omni dipole antenna to the outside of the unit and drive it with the XBee--Wireless access is great. I can be anywhere in the house to access it now.

The LCD display looks to be receiving a block of 187 bytes sent once per second. It is not modbus, but rather just a huge frame of data in response to the LCD sending a small block of data to the main board.. The bulk of the block is what appears to be unscaled grid voltage waveform values that plot nicely in an excel sheet when I tried it.. I see the grid voltage and current clamp wattage. I should be able to see the rest once I hook up PV power later.

...Really cool stuff
 
Wolf said:
Yes I have one and have successfully installed it on my Split phase 220 system.
I found these upgraded cable coils on ebay so that it would monitor both legs of my grid power L1 and L2.https://www.ebay.com/itm/Upgraded-cable-coils-for-US-220v-Grid-tie-inverter-with-Limiter-GTIL/232675119713?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

I also got the WiFi unit and after learning chinese (just kidding) I do have a computer background I got the unit to work and it transmits my plant info every 5 min to a data collection center which Ican access at www.shinemonitor.com and can see what I am producing.
The neat thing about this unit is that lets say my house needs 1000 watts of power the Cable Coils will tell the GTIL what is coming from the grid and will produce up to the throttled amount 900 watts (I have mine throttled at 900 watts)and the grid is now only supplying me with 100 watts through the meter effectively cutting my electrical consumption. Also if my house only needs 500 watts than the GTIL will produce that and effectively stall the grid meter which is just drawing 5 to 7 watts just to let the grid company know i'm still here. It does not feed the grid hence those of us with "Smart Meters" don't get penalized. It also automatically throttles down as the voltage of my now 6 month old newly antiquated flooded cell battery bank goes below a safe discharge voltage and wakes back up as soon as my panels start producing amperage. Once my flooded cell system isreplaced by a Li system (after harvesting 2000 to 3000 cells that I will need) I can then dialit in to use more power from my panels anduse the cell storage at night so I don't have to worry about killing my flooded pain in the rear picky lead acid batteries.

Pictures and wiring diagrams


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attached. Let me know if you have any questions.
Picture of GTIL is before I tweaked the throttle. Notice it was producing 984.8w and grid supplemented with 116w.

Wolf

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I didnt think too deeply into this as I am not this far along in my planning yet but I have a question about your setup. It may be a stupid question just becauseI haven't thought it through yet. You have a 220v split phase supply coming into your house, half of your house is on one leg and the other half is on the other leg. You purchased a 220V GTIL (as opposed to the 120V model) which you are using 2 current sensors in series(maybe this is where my assumption is wrong and the GTIL is sensing and feeding each leg independently) to monitor both legs of the 220V lines. In this type of setup, isn't it possible that one leg (half your house) is using more current then the other leg but then since you are using current sensors in series the GTIL cant tell the difference between which leg is using more power so it simply sends out the total current sensed. This means one leg could get more current then its using and the other leg less than its using, doesn't this cause back feeding to the meter on one leg(leg that is using less current)and underfeeding of the other leg(leg that is using more current)?

Best Regards,James
Click to expand...
 
JM1,

I'm not sure exactly how it works but it does. I believe the GTILinjects the amperage at a slightly higher voltage and the "house" uses that first. If the sensors detect that there is a potential of current flowing back to the meter it throttles itself down. I just know according to my "Smart Meter" (which is not smart enough to determine inflow vs outflow) it would indicate a higher usage which it does not. Since you can see by the charts from my power company and the GTILwireless link to shinemonitor.com that the 2 are correlated. GTILoutput compared to grid usage. The spikes you see is the Fride coming on and as you can see the GTIL absorbs all of that and another spike around Noon. House mate coming home for lunch. I have many such correlations as the system has been up and running since late August. Almost all of my AC esp. when it is hot and sunny is absorbed by the GTIL. Matter of fact I am thinking of getting a 2000 Watt unit for next summer. I have 3000 Watts of Panels up and I want to use all I can :D.

image_znbsbc.jpg

Wolf

PS:
If there is anyone out there that understands how the GTIL scrutinizes and determines which leg to feed let us know.
Inquiring er puzzledminds want to know :huh:.
 
The GTIL2 works onboth 120VAC and 240VAC interchangably. I run one in 120 and the other on 240V. No issues

How are those clamps wired? Series? Parallel?
 
aquaman said:
The GTIL2 works onboth 120VAC and 240VAC interchangably. I run one in 120 and the other on 240V. No issues

How are those clamps wired? Series? Parallel?
Click to expand...

I do not know but I will take a resistance reading as I have an original clamp and this modified 2 clamp version and get back to you.
I bought the modified one on ebayhttps://www.ebay.com/itm/Upgraded-cable-coils-for-US-220v-Grid-tie-inverter-with-Limiter-GTIL/232675119713?hash=item362c849261:m:mUO6Uuwgu0jtZB4XB0slTWw:rk:1:pf:0
Right now my shed is stuffed with summer toys and it is difficult to get at things but I will try :D.

Wolf
 
FYI - Here is a recap of a setup with 4 units, two powering each 120 leg, and I guess each pair of inverters is working fine when hooked up to the same leg.


Makes you question the value of the name brand units given the cost of these, $250-$280 a piece or $1k for 4 at 4kw vs an Outback 3648 at $1800 for 3.6k.
 
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Great stuff Solardad.
Nice video.

I did the voltage cutoff a little different and did not use relays.
In the programing function I set it for Bat or solar limited Power Mode where you can set your cutoff voltage.
I have tweaked it since then as I am still running Flooded batteries hopefully to change this coming year.

But as you can see by the display you can set your voltage to where the GTIL will go to sleep in this case it's 50.5V and the maximum output has been set to 900W. At 51.5V it wakes back up and starts to produce again. Of course the limit mode is set to on and as I am usingmodified L1 and L2 sensorclampstheinternal limiter is checked onso I don't backfeed the grid.

What's nice about this system is that as it approaches the lowvoltage limit it gradually reduces its output and then when it hits it it just iddles along with minimal wattage usage. Then as it hits the reboot voltage it wakes up and startsto draw of of the extra that the batteries don't need and during full sun it will use as much as its limit of 900 Watts allows if the house needs it. I certainly do not use as much as you as my house idles at around 200 Watts. Lately though with all my Li charging I think it may have gone up a bit. :)

Sorry for the bad picture but thats all I had at the moment.

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Wolf
 
Wolf,

I like your setup and may copy it with a 2000w gtil2. Have you experienced any power failures in your neighborhood since installing this? My main concern would be if the power fails in my neighborhood and my house was using less than the 2000W at the time, then I would back feed into the grid (due to the pull from the neighbours houses) and potentially injure a line worker due to the back feeding. I would like to design/add a sensor so if incoming power halts then the feed from the GTIL stops until I can flip a switch to isolate my house.
 
The GTIL2 will only deliver power when there is grid voltage from the utility. When utility power goes away, so will the GTIL. It supports anti-islanding thus avoids that problem. I do recollect seeing someone on youtube running the GTIL with non-grid-tie inverter though...
 
jm1 said:
Wolf,

I like your setup and may copy it with a 2000w gtil2. Have you experienced any power failures in your neighborhood since installing this? My main concern would be if the power fails in my neighborhood and my house was using less than the 2000W at the time, then I would back feed into the grid (due to the pull from the neighbours houses) and potentially injure a line worker due to the back feeding. I would like to design/add a sensor so if incoming power halts then the feed from the GTIL stops until I can flip a switch to isolate my house.
Click to expand...

JM1,
All Grid Tied Inverters that are worth their weight in salt have anti islanding, which basically means that if the grid power goes down the unit shuts down and wont feed the grid till it senses that it is back up. It works by first synchronizing itself with the frequency of the grid and then starts to inject power. So no worries as far as backfeeding the grid.

Wolf
 
Has anyone successfully setup the 2000w version in the US / split phase setup (120/240)?

Stumped in understanding if it is possible given the output is 220v. I assume wire output is euro spec., 1 hot, 1 neutral and 1 ground vs. US 2 hot and 1 neutral/ground.

I would love to have the larger inverter vs multiple 1ks at that price.

If so how did you wire it to your breaker?

Thanks...!
 
Solardad said:
Has anyone successfully setup the 2000w version in the US / split phase setup (120/240)?

Stumped in understanding if it is possible given the output is 220v. I assume wire output is euro spec., 1 hot, 1 neutral and 1 ground vs. US 2 hot and 1 neutral/ground.

I would love to have the larger inverter vs multiple 1ks at that price.

If so how did you wire it to your breaker?

Thanks...!
Click to expand...

I assume you bought the US version which floats the groundas a neutral.

Wiring diagram is in this post.
https://secondlifestorage.com/t-Ext...-SUN-1000G2-with-raspberry?pid=38810#pid38810

Let me know if you have any questions


Wolf
 
@wolf Thanks for the reply.

I did see your diagram earlier but I think I am missing a basic concept here. Here is some background.

I already installed two of the SUN-1000g inverters to a sub panel, one per leg via two dedicated 15amp breakers.
(Located in US so split phase). Results have been excellent but my array produces more than what the inverters can provide. So I want more.... ;-)

Looked at the products by Victron/Outback and given the results that I am seeing and the cost for what I know so far these $250 1k boxes are still a killer deal. (could be missing a big picture item but based on my results and testing I have yet to be disappointed over the past two months).

So I am interested in the SUN-2000 version but it is my understanding that it is EURO spec, has only one leg that is hot.
Unsure (based on my electrical knowledge) how that could work (without adding a step-down transformer 230 > 120/240) and be leveraged the same way as the SUN-1000 unit.

In reviewing your images it appears you have a SUN-1000 unit so maybe that is part of the confusion. If I was to wire the SUN-2000 that way I would expect 230V hitting only one 110/120v leg of that two pole breaker in your diagram, which i assume would be a no-no. Again this may be a miss based on my knowledge.

thanks!
 
Solardad,

I do believe you are right. Darn i was going to buy a 230VAC 2000GTIL also but now It has me wondering.

Yes I do have the 1000GTIL2 and it works wonderful on the L1 and L2 (they can be Stacked)
1000W -Model SUN-1000GTIL2-LCD
22-60VDC/45-90VDC,120VAC/230VAC

It does appear (and I mean only appear we could be wrong) that the 2000GTIL2 is limited to just 230VAC on 1 leg.
Although looking at the 2000 internals it does look like it is able to sense V on both legs. It has 2 mosfet channels and if it weresingle phase I don't see why it would need that. The only difference i see with the 1000 and the 2000 is the 2000 has more mosfets,transformers and capacitors.

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2000W- Model SUN-2000GTIL2-LCD
45-90VDC/230VAC
More research is needed maybe an email to one of the resellers as they do sell it to the US market so there has to be something that we are not seeing or missinghere.
None of us homeowners in the UShave single phase 230V so that would not make sense.

On another note the 1000 has auto sensing of the V on each leg. So if it sees 110 on one leg it goes into single phase mode and if it sees 110 on both legs it goes into 220V split phase mode. I just can't see that much of a design difference in the units. I also believe that the 230V unit is auto sensing as in the euro model one leg 230V one is neutral.

Hmm maybe someone else has may have experience with the 2000 GTIL2 please speak up.

Update:There is aGTIL Group on facebook. I don't really use it but I have requested membership.

Thanks

Wolf
 
Solardad,

The 2000w version should work as long as it hooked up to both phases, only caveat is that it will only service balanced loads without backfeeding. In other words, if your loads between your two phase (L1 & L2) are not balanced then it is possible you could back feed on one of the legs.This is assuming backfeeding is not allowed or desired.

Another option would be to stack the 1000w version, I have stacked multiple 1000w inverters per leg with limiter and it works great. The priority appears to be determined by the CT position on the service leg. The nextinverter in the stack will only start when the adjacentone is maxed out.

lepdiypowerwalls
 
lepdiypowerwalls,

If that's the case than I can use my dual CTs and not worry about the L1 L2 imbalance as my 1000GTIL2 works just fine with it.
No back feeding on either leg.
Both CTs are wired in parallel and 180 out of phase with each other so as to sample both sides and limit accordingly.
That is great news before summer comes I'm going for a 2000GTIL2. I already got the Wifi setup and workingetc.

Thanks for the info.

Wolf
 
@wolf Thanks for confirming. That is what I thought. ;-) It would be good to hear from someone that was successful in setting up the 2k version on a split phase system.

@lepdiypowerwalls Thanks for the info but you did hit on a key limitation for me at least.. "if your loads between your two phase (L1 & L2) are not balanced then it is possible you could back feed on one of the legs." This would be a show stopper for me if that was the case. Anal utility company that would love to charge me a monthly fee if I sold them power, so backfeeding to the street is a show stopper.

I wonder if there are any other manufactures with similar features as the sun-1000gtli but with a larger inverter, 2-5k? I have been unable to find them but even if it was only 110v I think there would be enough demand given the number of systems in the US that I am hearing about with multiple sun1000gtli setups.

For myself I may just bit the bullet and get another pair but I'll have to make more room on the wall to set them up.
 
Solardad,
Don't give up yet, Again with two CT's wired in parallel (1 CT on L1 and the other CTturned 180going around L2) goingto 1 GTLI 2000 you can effectively stop exporting to the grid because you are monitoring both phases.
I think I may get one sooner than later and verify that it will work. but I'm sure it will.

Wolf

Update: Yessssss it will work Auto sensing.


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