Inverter Syrio Power (same as pip 5048MG) jumps the differential switch

[calida82]

Hi, I have a Syrio Power SI5000MKS II inverter which appears to be identified as the more common Pip 5048MG. I have a problem, when the inverter tries to enter bypass mode, the differential switch installed upstream of the inverter jumps. If I disconnect the ground wire, the inverter is able to enter bypass mode without blowing the RCD, after going into bypass mode if I connect the ground again the RCD does not jump anymore.
I tried to unplug the PAR board but the differential still jumps. I tried unsoldering the two movs on the input line from the board, and all the blue capacitors near the network input cables that have a ground connection, but even that didn't solve the problem. The jump of the differential seems to take place the instant the relays trip.
can someone help me or show me the part of the card where to look for the problem?

 

[Old Seagull Man]

Hi, I have a Syrio Power SI5000MKS II inverter which appears to be identified as the more common Pip 5048MG. I have a problem, when the inverter tries to enter bypass mode, the differential switch installed upstream of the inverter jumps. If I disconnect the ground wire, the inverter is able to enter bypass mode without blowing the RCD, after going into bypass mode if I connect the ground again the RCD does not jump anymore.
I tried to unplug the PAR board but the differential still jumps. I tried unsoldering the two movs on the input line from the board, and all the blue capacitors near the network input cables that have a ground connection, but even that didn't solve the problem. The jump of the differential seems to take place the instant the relays trip.
can someone help me or show me the part of the card where to look for the problem?

 

[Korishan]

Salve, ho un inverter Syrio Power SI5000MKS II che sembra essere identificato come il più comune Pip 5048MG. Ho un problema, quando l'inverter cerca di entrare in modalità bypass salta l'interruttore differenziale installato a monte dell'inverter. Se scollego il cavo di terra , l'inverter è in grado di entrare in modalità bypass senza far saltare l'RCD, dopo essere entrato in modalità bypass se collego nuovamente la terra l'RCD non salta più.
Ho provato a scollegare la scheda PAR ma il differenziale salta ancora. Ho provato a dissaldare i due mov sulla linea di ingresso dalla scheda, e tutti i condensatori blu vicino ai cavi di ingresso di rete che hanno una connessione a massa, ma anche questo non ha risolto il problema. Il salto del differenziale sembra avvenire nell'istante in cui i relè scattano.
qualcuno può aiutarmi o indicarmi la parte della scheda dove cercare il problema?

Please, post your comments in English. I have already requested this in your Introduction post. We can't rely on other members to post translations for you (thanks @Old Seagull Man for doing this this time). Google Translate does a really good job between English<=>Spanish so please use that if you do not know english yourself.

 

[calida82]

I had used google translate only that chrome automatically translated the page for me and brought my translation back to Italian like the rest of the page. excuse me. I corrected my first message

 

[Korishan]

that chrome automatically

that's why I use firefox

hen the inverter tries to enter bypass mode, the differential switch installed upstream of the inverter jumps. If I disconnect the ground wire, the inverter is able to enter bypass mode without blowing the RCD, after going into bypass mode if I connect the ground again the RCD does not jump anymore.

It "almost" sounds to me that the there is current flowing on the Neutral wire when the hot is not live, or vice versa, and the RCD freaks out. Possible current leakage somewhere.
Not sure how that would be fixed. Maybe there's a timing issue during the switch over.
I could also be completely wrong on that. There are several here who have PIPs. So hopefully they'll be able to help out more.

 

[italianuser]

Sounds like a grounding problem to me, could be wrong... Or some dispersion on the Electrical circuit. DID you measure neutral-live, live-ground and neutral-ground in different areas of the house?

 

[calida82]

thanks for the intervention, I am sure it is not a problem that resides in my electrical system, I tried to disconnect the ac-output cables and the differential jumps anyway. I brought my inverter from my home to the place where I work, I only connected the ac-input cables and when I turn on and try the bypass the differential jumps. The problem is in the inverter. It seems that the phase goes into neutral because if I measure between earth and neutral ac-input in the instant in which the differential jumps I measure about 70V. I tried to disconnect from the card the 2 movs between neutral and earth and phase and earth, and all the blue capacitors connected to earth in the area where the ac input and output cables connect to the card but the differential still jumps if the earth cable it is always connected to the inverter when the inverter tries to go into bypass.
my inverter has a double contact relay which at rest joins neutral to earth. I read in the manual that this relay is programmable with setting 38 but my firmware was updated when I sent the inverter to service for error 08 and now setting 38 is no longer there (I'm not sure if before was) after servicing the inverter worked for more than a month until once the current went out and since then the differential jumps.
when you talk about relay activation times it can be, now I do not know if it is normal but when the inverter goes into bypass and the relays trip, it seems that they do not all trip together, or there is one that trips and then returns because it does not hears one sound but two. could it depend on the relay contacts being cooked?
another thing I have always tried found on the web is that on the motherboard there is a screw that holds the motherboard to the case that is different from all the others, and is located right in the relay area. a user says that that screw is different because it can be removed. I tried to remove the screw and the differential doesn't jump anymore. But I don't like this solution because that screw brings the safety movs and other capacitors to the ground, which by removing the screw would make their protection function useless, exposing the whole inverter to possible voltage peaks and surges coming from the grid.
someone can give me some more information on the screw, on the setting 38 that is no longer in my menu and on the release of the relays if you hear a single sound or it is normal that you hear 2?

 

[Korishan]

Here's a thread with a similar issue. Not sure if it'll help, but worth a look

Parallel PIP5048MK's are tripping house RCDs

I have just connected my second PIP5048MK in parallel using the OEM parallel board and cables to find that whenever the Utilities mains is connected my house RCD trips. I originally had one 5048MK connected direct to the mains to charge and test the batteries and had no problems. It's only...

secondlifestorage.com

 

[ziporah]

I had a similar issue with my 5k-et. After updating my firmware, the problem was gone. It took a while to figure out what was wrong and get the new firmware from goodwe, but in the end they came trough with the correct firmware and my device is stable now. The main issue was the N is supposed to be connected to PE during off-grid or backup mode, and it has to be disconnected again when back in normal mode. This wasn't the case, the N was always connected to PE, which made backup mode possible, but when switching back from backup to normal mode, the RCD breaks. New firmware disconnects PE and N before reconnecting L + N and problem solved

 

[Roland W]

I have a problem, when the inverter tries to enter bypass mode, the differential switch installed upstream of the inverter jumps. If I disconnect the ground wire, the inverter is able to enter bypass mode without blowing the RCD

Do not install RCDs upstream of a power source. They belong downstream.
Just protect your inverter AC input by a double pole breaker for shorts.

There is no need to protect the inverter itself by a RCD, the installation behind must be protected...

The mentioned blue capacitor on the inputs are actually varistors. They only connect to ground while a voltage surge from a lightning comes in by your power line...

Another thought...your leakage might not have anything to do with the inverter. Because when the inverter is in off-grid mode, and there is a downstream leakage by a connected appliance, the inverter doesn't have internal leakage detection. Only when it switches into bypass, the upstream RCD will be tripped by that appliance!

 

[ziporah]

In Belgium regulations force you to put an rcd downstream. It should just work, otherwise your inverter is misbehaving or isn’t connected correctly. Even in offgrid systems you have to put an rcd to protect yourself from electrocution