MPP Solar / Infinisolar MPI 10k hybrid inverter died - fuse goes off when synchronizing with grid


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Stefanseiner

Member
Joined
Apr 16, 2020
Messages
136
Hello,


after one year of usage my MPI 10k seems to be defective.
MPI10k_installed.jpg


Without grid connection it runs fine, but when I connect to the grid then the external fuse (Siemens 3x B16A) goes off.

at minute 0.50



- I double and triple checked all the wire connections including grounding and external circuit breaker
- I changed the fuse to a slower "C" rated model
- grid voltage is stable round about 230 volts


I changed the three phase wires in all possible combinations to avoid wrong connection
B / G / S fuse off S lights up in Siemens fuse
G / B / S Error 09 line phase loss
G / S / B fuse off B lights up in Siemens fuse
B / S / G Error 09 line phase loss
S / B / G fuse off G lights up in Siemens fuse
S / G / B Error 09 line phase loss

B = brown phase wire = phase 1
G = grey phase wire = phase 2
S = black phase wire = phase 3


Do you have some idea what's wrong or what could be defective?

Thanks and regards

Stefan
 

ziporah

Member
Joined
Apr 26, 2021
Messages
69
Stefan, did the inverter update itself to a new firmware version or did you change the country code? In some countries while off grid you need to connect Neutral to ground. When going back on grid, the inverter has to disconnect this connection. You should be able to hear it when going off to ongrid a relais should turn off. Your inverter has a 4 pole breaker, but the rest of your circuit is three pole, did you connect the neutral wire somewhere? My guess is you got 3x230 net and not 3x380. Do you have a rcd after the inverter? Have you tried running without solar and battery connected? See if it boots without DC. If you wired the neutral somewhere, try measuring the voltage between neutral and ground and neutral and the three phases. Neutral ground should be zero on and offgrid.
 

Stefanseiner

Member
Joined
Apr 16, 2020
Messages
136
Hello,
I am not running Off grid, just grid parallel.
The voltages between all phases, ground and neutral are OK, I meassured them all early.
230V between N + each phase, 400V between the phases.

I tried to run without batterie and it's the same. The MPI 10 connects to the grid, shows all voltages and frequency as "OK", tries to synchronize and then the fuse goes of.

No firmware update, it is as delivered a year before.
Neutral isn't connected to ground.

The only thing I changed was that I installed a 3-phased circuit breaker and swapped two phases, thats why the "phase loss" error showed the first time. I changed it back but there are some new warning messages and the fuse goes of every time
Warning messages.jpeg
 

ziporah

Member
Joined
Apr 26, 2021
Messages
69
Reading your comments, I find it very strange the breaker jumps, looking at the dark movie, it jumps with some serious current as well.
Do you have a clamp A-meter with hold function and can you put that around the phase that seems to give the big spark in the breaker ?
The inverter might be pushing more then the breaker is willing to handle.
btw, If you got 3phase + N, you should put a 4 pole breaker after the inverter. you have to disconnect the neutral wire as well as this might be having an offset voltage to the ground and it's still dangerous to touch. you should also put a RCD behind the inverter, that should protect you from ground faults in your inverter and make sure nobody gets electrified ...
 

Stefanseiner

Member
Joined
Apr 16, 2020
Messages
136
an rcd is installed and there are no 4 pole breaker for 3 phase devices.

And yes, when the breaker jumps there must be 100amps and more to see a light.
I can't smell any burnings but there is lots of frech qir around.


I now got in contact with MPP solar to tell the problem and now we will see, how their support and warranty works.

I will tell you here about the progress
 

Stefanseiner

Member
Joined
Apr 16, 2020
Messages
136
I had contact via mail with MPP-Solar.
They told me to make some tests and I made a video of this and send it to MPP-Solar.

After analyzing the video they suggest that the mainboard is defective.
It is sad for me that the inverter dies after 11 month of usage only, but much more sad that they now say I have to pay for the spare parts although the failure is within the warranty.
Voltronic_MPP-Solar_MPI_10k_warranty.jpeg



At this point I am very disappointed of MPP-Solar and I don't know if I should recommend inverters from Voltronic any more when other people are asking me :-(

But I still hope we can find a solution - and I will keep you up to date
 

Stefanseiner

Member
Joined
Apr 16, 2020
Messages
136
after several discussions MPP solar is willing to provide a new mainboard for free but with shipping costs of USD 110.
They do not accept it is within warranty time but a one-time goodwill.
I think it is because I write the process of warranty transaction of MPP Solar public at this forum (and others too)

With this clarified I took the service / disassembly manual and searched for the mentioned mainboard of the MPI 10k
-> Download of the service manual as pdf
it is the left pcb with the big coils and heatsinks on it
03_MPI_10k_Mainboard_defekt_01.jpg



I took pictures of all cables I had to remove so I can assemble the inverter later on the right way
03_MPI_10k_Mainboard_defekt_04.jpg


here it is
03_MPI_10k_Mainboard_defekt_06.jpg


at the back side I found an area with a damaged / non-existant resistor and some white dust around. The service manual says this is the "INV/REC module" for the "S-Phase". I guess the IGBT above is damaged and produces the short at the 230V AC side which is causing my problems with the falling circuit protection
03_MPI_10k_Mainboard_defekt_08.jpg



I wrote MPP-Solar back with this new knowledge and pictures, let's see what's going next.


btw. speaking of warranty:
I wonder, why MPP Solar only gives 1 Year of warranty to the end-user because Voltronic, the original manufacturer gives 2 years warranty to their reseller. This means that with a failure between 1 and 2 years Voltronic replaces the defective part for free to MPP Solar but they cash up the customer.

So I've done a little research which reseller gives how much warranty time:
 

Stefanseiner

Member
Joined
Apr 16, 2020
Messages
136
The new mainboard for my MPI 10k arrived
positive: shipping war very quick and took only 1 week from Taiwan to Germany
negative: 110 USD shipping costs have to paid from me

Here it is. Seems that it's a new revision with a slightly different pcb layout
MPI 10k Mainboard neu (1).jpg

MPI 10k Mainboard neu (2).jpg

I 'm going to insert the new mainbord these days and hope, that my MPI 10k will run again after this repair
 

Stefanseiner

Member
Joined
Apr 16, 2020
Messages
136
Last weekend I changed the mainboard and yesterday I startet the inverter.


But as I turned the solar-input switch at the bottom of the inverter to "on" I heard a sizzle at the same second and a little smoke came out of the right upper side of the inverter.


Now the inverter goes in an endless reboot loop and shows "error 03" which means "dc bus voltage soft-start is time-out"

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eRCGIXGHVo8



here is the error log from solarpower software
MPP-Solar_MPI_10k_03_new_mainboard_13.jpeg

Now I sent the video to MPP-Solar support with the question, at which area I should search for the damage.

At my first view to the (new) mainboard I couldn't find any damages, but I guess the failure comes somewhere from the solar-input side because the smoke was there after I turned the solar-switch.


Do you have any ideas?


Now I am curious what the MPP-Solar support may answer.
 

Micha

New member
Joined
Jun 14, 2022
Messages
1
Hallo,


nach einem Jahr Nutzung scheint mein MPI 10k defekt zu sein.
View attachment 27158

Ohne Netzanschluss läuft es einwandfrei, aber wenn ich es ans Netz anschließe dann geht die externe Sicherung (Siemens 3x B16A) los.

bei Minute 0.50



- Ich habe alle Kabelverbindungen einschließlich Erdung und externem Schutzschalter doppelt und dreifach überprüft
- Ich habe die Sicherung gegen ein langsameres "C"-Modell ausgetauscht
- Die Netzspannung liegt stabil bei etwa 230 Volt


Ich habe die dreiphasigen Drähte in allen möglichen Kombinationen geändert, um einen falschen Anschluss zu vermeiden
B / G / S-Sicherung aus S leuchtet in Siemens-Sicherung
G / B / S Fehler 09 Netzphasenverlust
G / S / B-Sicherung aus B leuchtet in Siemens-Sicherung
B / S / G Fehler 09 Leitungsphasenverlust
S / B / G-Sicherung aus G leuchtet in Siemens-Sicherung
S / G / B Fehler 09 Netzphasenverlust

B = brauner Phasendraht = Phase 1
G = grauer Phasendraht = Phase 2
S = schwarzer Phasendraht = Phase 3


Habt ihr eine Idee woran es liegt oder was defekt sein könnte?

Danke und Grüße

Stefan
Hallo,

ich wollte mir auch so ein Teil "MPI10K" zulegen.
Eigentlich nur als Insellösung. Autark das Haus betreiben.
Oder soll man einen anderen Wechselrichter nehmen?

Beste Grüße

Micha
 
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