Small off grid cabin system

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Dec 2, 2017
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I have a friend that asked me this weekend if I was interested in solar power, but we had just a few minutes to talk.

The short story is that he has a small cabin off the grid,with a small PV setup that he wants to add more capacity to.Hewas asking me if he should get some golf cart batteries.

I said it depends... and I asked what voltage the system was.He did not have any of the techie specs. He says the cabinhas conventional wiring and a transfer switch in case the batteries are too low so he can switch it manuallytogrid power (not grid tie).

He mentioned that the person that helped him select and install the system years ago suggested he swap out incandescent bulbs for LED, and minimize the wattage draw to try and get by, so the owner got some LED bulbs (110v, I assume) and said they would not work on off the grid (on solar), but seemed to be saying they work when on on the grid.

Before I start guessing about the shading of the panels in winter, the SOC of his batteries, and the output of theinverter, I wanted to ask if you had ever heard of "simple" devices like LED bulbs not working properly on an inverter. I tried explaining that LEDs are solid state devices and the LED bulbs are not as simple as the hot glowing wire in an incandescent bulb, but I think I lost him when i mentioned solid state.

I am aware that sensitive electronics won't work on a modified square wave inverter, but this seems curious and has me wondering about thetypes of power conditions LED bulbs mayhave an issue with.

I will take a good look at the system and get model numbers on everything this weekend. I plan to take a good voltmeter and a new 1000w inverter (12v) in case he has a 12v system or wants to try the bulb on another inverter, etc....

I also have an oscilloscope to look at the inverter outputto see what the AC outputlooks like.

I was planning to start measuring the DC at the batteries and go from there... if batteries are close to the input voltage for the inverter, then look at the output. If thebatteries are low, look at the charge controller and panel outputs.

Any suggestions or ideas for what to check to make sure the components in thesystem areOK ?
 
Earlier LED bulbs had huge issues with modified or square wave inverters! Even badly done "pure" sine wave can create issues actually.

Just check voltages on batteries and all that. If you can then check acid levels. Make sure all contacts are clean and nice. No corrosion or such. Make sure no dust in electronics and fuses are on proper places. Thats where I would start.
 
SecondHandPower said:
I have a friend that asked me this weekend if I was interested in solar power, but we had just a few minutes to talk.

The short story is that he has a small cabin off the grid,with a small PV setup that he wants to add more capacity to.Hewas asking me if he should get some golf cart batteries.

I said it depends... and I asked what voltage the system was.He did not have any of the techie specs. He says the cabinhas conventional wiring and a transfer switch in case the batteries are too low so he can switch it manuallytogrid power (not grid tie).

He mentioned that the person that helped him select and install the system years ago suggested he swap out incandescent bulbs for LED, and minimize the wattage draw to try and get by, so the owner got some LED bulbs (110v, I assume) and said they would not work on off the grid (on solar), but seemed to be saying they work when on on the grid.

Before I start guessing about the shading of the panels in winter, the SOC of his batteries, and the output of theinverter, I wanted to ask if you had ever heard of "simple" devices like LED bulbs not working properly on an inverter. I tried explaining that LEDs are solid state devices and the LED bulbs are not as simple as the hot glowing wire in an incandescent bulb, but I think I lost him when i mentioned solid state.

I am aware that sensitive electronics won't work on a modified square wave inverter, but this seems curious and has me wondering about thetypes of power conditions LED bulbs mayhave an issue with.

I will take a good look at the system and get model numbers on everything this weekend. I plan to take a good voltmeter and a new 1000w inverter (12v) in case he has a 12v system or wants to try the bulb on another inverter, etc....

I also have an oscilloscope to look at the inverter outputto see what the AC outputlooks like.

I was planning to start measuring the DC at the batteries and go from there... if batteries are close to the input voltage for the inverter, then look at the output. If thebatteries are low, look at the charge controller and panel outputs.

Any suggestions or ideas for what to check to make sure the components in thesystem areOK ?

My guess is they have an old-school "modified sine wave" inverter (ie a square wave inverter). Slap your oscilloscope on the output and see how it looks.

Try to measure the current output from the PV too.

Good luck.

Cheers, Paul
 
PaulKennett said:
SecondHandPower said:

My guess is they have an old-school "modified sine wave" inverter (ie a square wave inverter). Slap your oscilloscope on the output and see how it looks.

Try to measure the current output from the PV too.

Good luck.

Cheers, Paul

Thanks guys,

I checked my new-inbox inverter and see it is a 2000w and 12 or 24v modified sine wave... I will get mine going on 12v and try a few LED bulbsto see if I can find a combination that will work.

That would accelerate one of my projects that got me into 18650's in the first place. I bought this inverter before I learned to builda 48v system....

image_dlnomg.jpg

image_pzhdrh.jpg


I am a bit leery about trying myinverter on 24v, as the sticker on the bottom says 12v, but the spec sheet says it is OK with 12 or 24v...
 
I'd run it 24 as there will be less Amp draw for the same load.
 
And the documentation clearly states it can run 24V. The only thing you might wanna double check is to make sure there isn't some switch you need to toggle. If it's auto-adjusting, fine. but if it's not, you could end up with smoke. So make sure of that first before connecting 24V.
 
If your friend's system is flooded lead acid and they are old, might be time to replace the batts, or try to "renew"them. I have used golf cart batts and have revived low performing batteries by replacing the H2so4 - the acid. If they are really sulfated there's not much you can do to bring them back. Get a hydrometer from the auto parts store and check the batts...
 
I was able to do a visit to the cabin and get some basic info.

The system was installed about 4 years ago. It hasgo. There are two inverters:
1) Aims BCT010009D 2500 watt 12V (12v 2p)
2) Aims PWRINV500024W 5000 watt 24v (12v 2p2s)

(6) 12v deep cycle marine batteries that were bought new from WM 4 yrs ago.

There are 4 panels, unknown wattage, about 4sq ft each.

The panels are roof mounted, and face SSE since the corner of the cabin is facing to the direct south.

There are two CME30A PWM charge controllers, one for each system.

Ther is a manual transfer switch for backup power from a gas powered AC generator.

The cables appear to have some galvanized hardware and visible rust....

image_fjzadx.jpgimage_ctosdj.jpg
 
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