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Can these inverters be used for 400V 3 phase? MPI 4K discontinued!!
#1
We bought a house!

Now I'm planning a big solar system. There are already 18 panels with a grid tied sma inverter. My plan is as follows:

As for now I want to let the 18 panels as they are. In addition:

3 x 15 solar panels: 275 Wp, 38,5 Voc, 31,1 Vmpp, 9,25 Asc. Ground mounted in the backyard.

3 inverters: Voltronic hybrid 4kW

But the question is can these inverters be used to take care of 1 phase each?? I cannot find anything about this in the specs. There is only stated that they can be used in parallel on 1 phase and nothing about a 3 phase config. Or should I go to the 10 kW inverter like Daromer and Wim are using?

I tried to contact Voltronic last week via there website but no answer. Two days ago I send the question to sales@voltronic.com.tw but still no reaction. Is it better to contact one of there dealers like MPP solar?

Ciao, Rik
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#2
If you wanted to divide the load of the house across 3x inverters you could use these.
If you want true 3 phase to eg run a 3ph motor, etc then I'd suggest looking for inverters that specifically say they can be configured for 3 phase.
If they don't specifically say they do 3 phase, then you'd have to assume they don't.
Korishan likes this post
Running off solar, DIY & electronics fan :-)
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#3
(01-19-2019, 12:19 PM)Redpacket Wrote: If you wanted to divide the load of the house across 3x inverters you could use these.
If you want true 3 phase to eg run a 3ph motor, etc then I'd suggest looking for inverters that specifically say they can be configured for 3 phase.
If they don't specifically say they do 3 phase, then you'd have to assume they don't.

Hi Redpacket, tnx for your reply. Meanwhile I found this pdf on MPP Solar website. There they are connected to 3p via energymeter and modbus. So I guess it is possible. I requested a price so hopefully they'll reply soon. Maybe it is also interesting not to take 3 x MPI 4K but the 10K 3p system. I was afraid it couldn't deleiver enough power per fase since we are planning to start cooking electrical as well but now I see it can deliver up to 16kW using a grid relay. That would be fine.

When I get more info from MPP or Voltronics I'll let it know.

Rik
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#4
Sounds like you need to understand your loads carefully.
If they actually need proper 3 phase that's quite different to just having a lot of kW of loads.
If you configure the inverters as 3 phase, the standby current might be different (higher) to if you had loads shared across 3x inverters if some of those loads were not used often, the inverters could switch to standby, etc.
Running off solar, DIY & electronics fan :-)
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#5
Ok, Peggy from MPP replied.

This is her answer:

With MPI10kw,   3 phase,  each phase will be around 3300w  , divide 220vac,  around 15A – 15.5A  each phase of ac output
But under Grid relay model. the inverter can support up to 20kw , so it will be 30A  per phase .
 
With MPI10kw, it is currently in stock, can be sent after payment
 
While for MPI4kw, the lead time will be 30 days after order.
And it will be more convenient to have just one inverter to control the system instead of having 3 .
 
Please also find the price info here
 
MPI10kw : USD 2270+ USD 330 DHL fee
MPI 4kw : USD 990 /pc  * 3 pc    , plus DHL shipping UD 439

So it seems MPI 10kW is the way to go. I Asked here if she has some more info about how the grid relay works and how it should be connected but maybe someone here can tell that as well.
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#6
Grid relay is when it just relays grid over. Either combining or switching to grid power throughput.

If you look at my diagrams you can see how I wired mine. For 100% utilization you need to wire it like I do where the house is actually hooked up after the inverter. The MPI 10kW also have grid-tie function so you need approval for running that machine in most countries. Does not matter if you feed to grid or not BECAUSE its floating middle point so its impossible to 100% controll it basically. If you dont need

If you dont need to feed back to grid you are way better off using the off-grid versions. They are cheaper and less waste of energy compare to the hybrid versions.
The Ultimate DIY Solar and build place
YouTube / Forum system setup / My webpage  Diy Tech & Repairs

Current: 10kW Mpp Hybrid | 4kW PIP4048 | 2x PCM60x | 83kWh LiFePo4 | 10kWh 14s 18650 |  66*260W Poly
Upcoming: 14S 18650~30kWh | Automatic trip breakers, and alot more
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#7
Hi daromer,

Tnx for the explanation about the grid relay but what do you mean exactly. I want to connect the house as AC load on the inverter like you do. So nothing will be powered direct from the grid. But surplus of power will be feed back into the grid although I'll try to keep that to a minimum. In case there is need for more power then PV and battery can deliver it would be the best that just a little power from the grid is "mixed" just enough to power everything as is demanded. Can that be done? And if so, does this relay play a role in this process or is it simply switching the house over to grid when demand is more than rated power of inverter so ALL power is coming from the grid? But I guess thats what you mean with "Either combining or switching to grid power throughput.". So a long question in short: when will it combine and when will it put through?

About approval, yes I know. It is not that difficult here in the Netherlands.

Meanwhile Peggy answered same question:

"Grid relay is a function and it can be programmed from the inverter LCD controller
Basically, it is a feature to instruct the inverter to use Grid power ,support with the load, and it is therefore, under this feature, it can support up to 20kw of ac load power. ‘"
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#8
It can combine yes. Its a nice feature but it wont do 20kw... Perhaps peak Smile
The Ultimate DIY Solar and build place
YouTube / Forum system setup / My webpage  Diy Tech & Repairs

Current: 10kW Mpp Hybrid | 4kW PIP4048 | 2x PCM60x | 83kWh LiFePo4 | 10kWh 14s 18650 |  66*260W Poly
Upcoming: 14S 18650~30kWh | Automatic trip breakers, and alot more
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#9
(01-22-2019, 04:25 PM)daromer Wrote: It can combine yes. Its a nice feature but it wont do 20kw... Perhaps peak Smile

This story continues. Received the new specs, now it says 22k for the 10kW MPI. Don't know how to attach a PDF.

I decided to go for the 4K unit but now Peggy says its out of stock. Damnit! Tried to contact Voltronic as well but they have so far never replied to inquiries via their webform nor direct email. Hmm... Any suggestions where to buy the 4K MPI?

Rik

-------------------------------------

Edit, I just called Voltronic. Talked to Steven, he promised me to answer my mails.
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#10
Ok, got answer from both Steven (Voltronic) and Peggy (MPPsolar), Model 4K will be discontinued. So now its plan B, the 5K model. Parallelable (is that a word?) to 3 phase / 400V AC.
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