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many 1s 120p packs in series to 48v
#1
your thoughts on this? I am considering the idea of building many 1s 120p or more packs and hooking them in series to get to 48 volts, then have them in parallel with another set just as large. this will eventually be what will become a whole house powerwall being mounted in a very nice industrial MCC cabinet that I am getting through work. its fairly large so building a fairly large wall is the goal. what are the downsides to using this config and the advantages if there are any. I also have access to whatever sized cable I could ever need. 
Thanks for your time and knowledge in advance.
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#2
there are many 14s 100p powerwalls on this forum look arround and use the search function and you find a lot of stuff about your setup that you are building Big Grin
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#3
Thats basically what everyone does.
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#4
Only people who make a single pack that is 7s, 14s, etc and many in parallel (ex. 14s80p) are those who are using it in some sort of portable application like a gocart, large power bank (some have used a suitcase or large container), and the like.

Recommendation on building large parallel packs and then series connect them, make your connections so you can have individual strings so if you need to take one out of service you can without needing to bring the whole system down.
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#5
thanks for the confirmation on my plan guys. its great to have this resource.
if its already broke it is now an educational tool.... lets tear it apart now.
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#6
(11-04-2019, 05:09 AM)Cancri Wrote: thanks for the confirmation on my plan guys. its great to have this resource.

My powerwall is loosely 14s120p  (as you have talked about).   

I start with a base pack of 130ah (1s60p) and couple 2 together to make a base 260ah (1s120p) as you see here.     


Each row of 14s120p yields 260ah@48v  ~ 12.5kwh.   I went with this 14s120p for shelf size and weight and Batrium longmon considerations.  Turns out Batrium longmon easily balances 1s120p pack so 1s240p or 1s300p 'balance wise' with Batrium is no problem.    However, the physical weight etc is more convenient at 1s120p for me.



The *key thing* that I did (accidentally) is I have a 'base pack' that can accommodate 76physical cells - using the cell holder structure to protect the +/- lugs.  Typically I only need 46 to 60 cells to reach my standard 130ah per base pack - depends on the cell type.   Putting to base packs together give me 260ah/pack and several empty spaces for each pack.   Once I put the packs online, I found that 5 (of 42 packs) so far have needed some tweaking - and I've added a few cells to them to bring them up with the other packs so that I have really good balance.      

This is of course completely arbitrary to your situation, battery mounting, physical strength, area of work etc...   I think every single person has done something a little different.  Just sharing my experience in case it helps you Smile
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#7
I have a large mcc cabinet from work that will house my power wall cabinet its a little over 6ft tall and 4ft wide. Will be anchored to the concrete floor of my garage. With four locking doors two on each side, one door has a thick acrylic window that runs most of the doors length. The other side has a 15 in flat screen monitor. Can i output the batrium screen to that monitor you think?
if its already broke it is now an educational tool.... lets tear it apart now.
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#8
(11-04-2019, 09:54 PM)Cancri Wrote: I have a large mcc cabinet from work that will house my power wall cabinet its a little over 6ft tall and 4ft wide. Will be anchored to the concrete floor of my garage. With four locking doors two on each side, one door has a thick acrylic window that runs most of the doors length. The other side has a 15 in flat screen monitor. Can i output the batrium screen to that monitor you think?
The shelves in my picture are exactly 48" and have 14s worth of packs per row - so you should be able to fit a 14s 'battery' per shelf in your cabinet.

>15 in flat screen monitor.
The standard batrium 'piano-key' screen is a windows application - so sure as long as the monitor is hooked to a windows machine.  Otherwise, you'll need to go deeper with your own app that reads Batrium info.
Here's the standard Batrium screen from my own system:
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#9
Depending on your battery supply chain… have you considered using any other sort of large format battery?

If you are opting to do it for as little money as possible processing reclaimed cells is great, and the process is well documented, but many have also went the route of buying other types of batteries (EV modules, LiFePO4 prismatic, or similar)

Just something to consider before committing to a direction. While I enjoy using 18650 cells for portables and smaller projects, it’s a significant undertaking to source, process, QC, and fabricate batteries using 18650 cells. I would weight this against the cost of cells and the cost to make them into packs. You might be surprised at the cost per kWh comparison.
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#10
(11-05-2019, 01:51 AM)Crimp Daddy Wrote: Depending on your battery supply chain… have you considered using any other sort of large format battery?

If you are opting to do it for as little money as possible processing reclaimed cells is great, and the process is well documented, but many have also went the route of buying other types of batteries (EV modules, LiFePO4 prismatic, or similar)

Just something to consider before committing to a direction.  While I enjoy using 18650 cells for portables and smaller projects, it’s a significant undertaking to source, process, QC, and fabricate batteries using 18650 cells.  I would weight this against the cost of cells and the cost to make them into packs.  You might be surprised at the cost per kWh comparison.

Agree 100%.  I'm 18650 because my battery bank is 2/3 complete..  so its too late for me at this point as 18650 is cheaper in the short run and I have time (to build them up) and I have trusted sources to buy 18650s from hard experience.  

If you could go tesla modules or Nissan leaf cells (bigger per unit) or LifePo4 (bigger and longer life) from the get-go, it might be easier in the long run.    The problem here (for me) is establishing a trusted source to buy these things at a price near enough 18650 to take the plunge - I was just not able to do this.

18650 cells are 'many small units' and I've spent nearly 2 years part-time (I'm retired so its OK for me) processing 7,000 cells with 2,000 more on the way.  Its been a *large* amount of personal time/commitment to process so many 'small' units.
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