Poll: how high is the total capacity of all cells?
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< 49.999 mAh
60.00%
3 60.00%
50.000 - 99.999 mAh
0%
0 0%
100.000 - 199.999 mAh
20.00%
1 20.00%
200.000 - 299.999 mAh
0%
0 0%
300.000 - 399.999 mAh
0%
0 0%
400.000 - 508.799 mAh
0%
0 0%
508.800 mAh
0%
0 0%
> 508.800 mAh
20.00%
1 20.00%
Total 5 vote(s) 100%
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China batterie 18650 test - 508.800mAh in 62 cells
#1
Hello everyone,

most of you will know them, many (or hopefully all) will avoid them, maybe some are even fallen for it: 
China-cells with enormous capacity values

A few month ago, as I didn't now anything about 18650 and LiIon in generall, I stumbled over some "Ultrafire 6.000mAh" on eBay.


They seemed to be just good enough for my little bluetooth speaker project 


I bought 12 pieces of them for a 6s2p config. But music goes off after 10 minutes   Huh

So I started to Google about 18650 and my research leads me to this board (and to HB's videos on YT about fake cells)

By the way: this point was the beginning of my "missery"

Actually I am building an 10 - 15KWh powerwall for my house out of used cells from eBike and laptop batteries.

Because there are just a few tests with specific results out there (and in the German regions of the internet there are absolutely no tests you will find) I decided to make my own test just to have clarification for me and for others too.

I spend a few bucks (round about 80USD) and ordered some cells from different vendors, most came from Aliexpress, a few from eBay.
 

Meanwhile, they arrived all except for a 4pcs package. In total this are 508.800mAh in 62 cells


to geht reliable capacity results I ordered 4x the same type


except this six ones on the right side because they were to expensive for me (2 - 3 USD pp but the seller promises "real values, no ridiculous capacities" up to 3.400 mAh)


within the test field:  such "modest" candidates like these
 

and some brand new super-cells which left the 9.900mAh border behind them


just like some chinese ultra-lightweight builds
 

I will measure:
- intern resistance
- voltage
- weight
- temperature while charging
- effective capacity

Here is my measuring equippement:  Vapcell YR-1030 / mini libra / noname-IR thermometer / LiitoKala Lii500


When the last package arrived I wil start testing and keep you and this topic updated.

If you want you can guess the test-result at the survey
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#2
I have done multiple videos on the topic along with others. We already know they are crap Smile

I guess 400mAh per cell if their weight is 23g. But if they are the higher 41g they are above 1Ah.

You can also find all tests on lygte if you want Wink
https://lygte-info.dk/review/batteries20...%20UK.html

I dont want to destroy your idea of testing but just so you know of ir you have more fun things to do they are all already tested Smile
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#3
Nice test about the Ultrafire with plenty of information, thanks for the link.
I won't waste too much time with the single cells but want to cover a wide range of different types to see, if they all are crap or if there exist some good for the price.
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#4
These cells are plain fraud, and the sellers should not be rewarded with anything.
Finish one round of tests, and start an Aliexpress buyer protection dispute ASAP and demand a full refund. Don't send back, don't settle for partial refund. The sellers will back down in less than 2 weeks, because Aliexpress staff will get involved after that and then the sellers will face serious penalties.
Wolf and OffGridInTheCity like this post
Modular PowerShelf using 3D printed packs.  60kWh and growing.
https://secondlifestorage.com/showthread.php?tid=6458
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#5
(05-20-2020, 10:26 AM)ajw22 Wrote: Finish one round of tests, and start an Aliexpress buyer protection dispute ASAP and demand a full refund.

Thanks for this tip, I think I will do exactly so.

btw.:
the last candidate arrived today, four "Kedanone" with 12.000mAh


now the test field is complete


20 different types fom 10 vendors


I will start testing tomorrow as soon as my LiitoKala charger are free
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#6
(05-20-2020, 10:26 AM)ajw22 Wrote: start an Aliexpress buyer protection dispute ASAP and demand a full refund. 

They will have a whole list of BS excuses why you "must" cancel the dispute, including:

* promise to refund per Paypal or other means.  Make sure to cancel only after you've received the refund.
* you must send the product back, of course expecting you to give up.  State that it is against transportation laws to send lithium batteries that are clearly defective.
* Just a bad batch - they've already sent replacement products.  They may even give you a tracking number destined to your country, but that may just be a "reservation" number and no actual package may have been sent.  I've had sellers change the tracking number 3 times as a delaying tactic.  State clearly that you're only going to cancel the dispute after you've received and tested the replacement.

There are probably many more.  Some will lie their ass off to get you to cancel ASAP.  Just stay firm and wait for either the seller to grant you the full refund you deserve, or for Aliexpress staff (who know about all the BS tactics) to get involved.
upsidedownlemon and Stefanseiner like this post
Modular PowerShelf using 3D printed packs.  60kWh and growing.
https://secondlifestorage.com/showthread.php?tid=6458
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#7
There is no way I would keep or consider using those.

If you allow them to win, they keep doing it. You did the right thing by sharing, many know, but many don't.

Get the word out, and also stand up for dispute that shit. Get some discharge charts and throw it in their face. Full Refund.
ajw22 likes this post
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#8
I 'gave in' and tried some orders 2 yrs ago thru Ebay of 'new cells'.  Did 3 seperate (what I thought was independent) orders of same cell type thinking to find at least 1 good source.  The 'new' cells looked great but only had 1800mah out of 2600mah promised.   When I requested return they said (ALL 3) - Oh sorry, how about you keep them for a discount?   I emailed - OK,  1800/2600 = 69%, how about you refund me 30% of the price?     They all offered same amount - $20 off the order.  $20 would have been about 2% of price.    I was able to return because of Ebay policies - but one of them made me pay for shipping (refused to provide a shipping label).  

It was the 3 seperate orders - but all 3 tried the same exact scam, right down to same $20 that really woke me up to how organized this can be.  Sad
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#9
There are 2 types of ultra-fakes I usually encounter:

Very fakes very light ones that yield between 40 and 200 mAh.
Normal fakes that are a little heavier (still way under 4x grams) that can initially yield 300-500mAh.
I can post the exact weights if needed.

Note that yields drop very fast mostly after just a few uses.

I can use these only on very low power lasers (<100mWs).
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#10
I've seen a few videos of people disassembling those fakes, and finding tiny LiIon cells inside the bigger 18650 case. Some found sand filled into the void to make it heavier. Of course those tiny cells won't have the capacity of a true 18650, or the current rating. So even a very conservative 500mA charging/discharging is probably overtaxing and killing it.
Modular PowerShelf using 3D printed packs.  60kWh and growing.
https://secondlifestorage.com/showthread.php?tid=6458
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