owitte
Member
- Joined
- Oct 19, 2016
- Messages
- 245
Hello all,
don't know about your "solar history", but I started my system with sealed lead-acid batteries, because -at that time and my state of knowledge then- they're the cheapest storage solution.
So, before I started collecting 18650s for my Li-Ion powerwall, I used 8 "conventional" batteries put together in 2s4p for a 24V battery pack with 940Ah. Worked fine for about a year and a half.
I then thought about how to use the capacity of Li-Ion batteries without replacing the older lead-acid ones. And of course, I also didn't want to replace my charge controllers and my inverter. I then came to the conclusion that, from the technical specs of the chargers and the inverter, it shouldn't be any problem to enhance the capacity of my old batteries with AN 18650-powerwall:
The chargers are designed to linearily charge lead-acid batteries up to 28.8V. For a 7s setup with Li-Ions this means each series will have a maximum voltage of 4.11V (28.8/7).
My inverter automatically switches one phase from grid to battery and back to grid depending on battery SOC. There're 3 settings, I chose the one that switches to battery as soon as possible (@27.6V) and back to grid as late as possible (@23.6V). That's a voltage range for my 18650s in 7s from 3.37 (23.7/7) to 3.94V (27.6/7).
So, my Li-Ion batteries will always work in a voltage range between 3.37 and 4.11V, which is almost an ideal range for them - and which means that this setup in fact acts like a BMS: It prevents the 18650s from overcharging and overdischarging, because the inverter and charge controllers take care ofthat: Charge controller stops charging at 28.8V (cell voltage 4.11V) because it thinks the batteries are full, inverter switches to grid at 23.6V (cell voltage 3.37V) because it thinks the batteries are empty.
The only BMS functions that's still missing is balancing. My solution for this are 1s single cell balancers (link upon request), that can be connected together for as many batteries in series as needed and provide a max. balance current of 10A between the seriesses.
I have this setup up and running for a few months now while step-by-step enhancing my Li-Ion powerwall capacity. And it turned out to work much better than expected: As soon as I added the first 5kWh with 18650s (700 pieces, 100p7s), I could also power device that consume 1000 to 1500W. This didn't work before with lead-acid batteries only, because the voltage drop on loads that high caused the inverter to switch back to grid. Now, with actually 1400 cells and 10kWh, it's doesn't make any problems to power devices with 3000W consumption for a (quite long) while - which results in a remaining grid consumption of 0.5 to 1kWh per day, when running on battery. And I never experienced a voltage difference in my Li-Ion powerwall of more than 40mV.
Phew, that was a lot of text and partially very theoretical, but I would be very interested what you all think about this setup, especially concerning usabillity and safety (I know, thermal monitoring is missing, but I'm already working on that) and if anyone else has done something similar...
Thanks to all and have sun!
Oliver
don't know about your "solar history", but I started my system with sealed lead-acid batteries, because -at that time and my state of knowledge then- they're the cheapest storage solution.
So, before I started collecting 18650s for my Li-Ion powerwall, I used 8 "conventional" batteries put together in 2s4p for a 24V battery pack with 940Ah. Worked fine for about a year and a half.
I then thought about how to use the capacity of Li-Ion batteries without replacing the older lead-acid ones. And of course, I also didn't want to replace my charge controllers and my inverter. I then came to the conclusion that, from the technical specs of the chargers and the inverter, it shouldn't be any problem to enhance the capacity of my old batteries with AN 18650-powerwall:
The chargers are designed to linearily charge lead-acid batteries up to 28.8V. For a 7s setup with Li-Ions this means each series will have a maximum voltage of 4.11V (28.8/7).
My inverter automatically switches one phase from grid to battery and back to grid depending on battery SOC. There're 3 settings, I chose the one that switches to battery as soon as possible (@27.6V) and back to grid as late as possible (@23.6V). That's a voltage range for my 18650s in 7s from 3.37 (23.7/7) to 3.94V (27.6/7).
So, my Li-Ion batteries will always work in a voltage range between 3.37 and 4.11V, which is almost an ideal range for them - and which means that this setup in fact acts like a BMS: It prevents the 18650s from overcharging and overdischarging, because the inverter and charge controllers take care ofthat: Charge controller stops charging at 28.8V (cell voltage 4.11V) because it thinks the batteries are full, inverter switches to grid at 23.6V (cell voltage 3.37V) because it thinks the batteries are empty.
The only BMS functions that's still missing is balancing. My solution for this are 1s single cell balancers (link upon request), that can be connected together for as many batteries in series as needed and provide a max. balance current of 10A between the seriesses.
I have this setup up and running for a few months now while step-by-step enhancing my Li-Ion powerwall capacity. And it turned out to work much better than expected: As soon as I added the first 5kWh with 18650s (700 pieces, 100p7s), I could also power device that consume 1000 to 1500W. This didn't work before with lead-acid batteries only, because the voltage drop on loads that high caused the inverter to switch back to grid. Now, with actually 1400 cells and 10kWh, it's doesn't make any problems to power devices with 3000W consumption for a (quite long) while - which results in a remaining grid consumption of 0.5 to 1kWh per day, when running on battery. And I never experienced a voltage difference in my Li-Ion powerwall of more than 40mV.
Phew, that was a lot of text and partially very theoretical, but I would be very interested what you all think about this setup, especially concerning usabillity and safety (I know, thermal monitoring is missing, but I'm already working on that) and if anyone else has done something similar...
Thanks to all and have sun!
Oliver